14:32 - 15:52
[14:32] ***jackdaw has joined #defib
[14:32] <noname> where is other folks?
[14:32] <PbN> hi noname
[14:32] <Surd> are your feathers ruffled, jackdaw?
[14:32] <Surd> welcome back pretty bird
[14:32] <PbN> noname, we is it
[14:32] <noname> ok
[14:32] <joecow> steve you use the marquis tag in some pieces - anything else IE only?
[14:33] <jackdaw> ruffled ruffled
[14:33] <jackdaw> pretty pretty
[14:33] <noname> PbN, there are many people on the list, but only about 10 shown up. :-)
[14:34] <steve_d> i don't think so, but _big up_ and _blacklight_ at are *much* better with msie
[14:34] <PbN> IE marquis -- what does it do?
[14:34] <noname> Jim, what's the topic for today chat, Jim?
[14:34] <Surd> Steve Duffy's great work.
[14:34] <steve_d> the smileys non-sychronous with netscape
[14:35] <steve_d> marquees are scrollers, basically
[14:35] <PbN> ah, like JS marquis functions -- thx
[14:36] <noname> steve, but marquees tag don't work with Netscape, do they?
[14:37] <eliza> They flash instead don't they?
[14:37] <steve_d> i don't think so - unless v4.0 has taken them onboard as it were
[14:38] <Surd> Steve, you seem to be an odd bird Brit with your long standing and highly sophisticated attention to scripting and You and Elizabeth and Peter... anyone else in England? Cayley and Cheek, too...
[14:39] <eliza> Oh I just spectate... but I love it.
[14:40] <steve_d> there are other, i'm sure, peter manson, peter finch ... elizabeth, got any more?
[14:40] <eliza> Artist called Simon Biggs, seen a couple of lovely works of his
[14:41] <Cleo> did you see the Circadia Project in Cauldron? some very script heavy brits
[14:41] <steve_d> oh, yes, for trace
[14:41] <eliza> (Influenced by John C I thought)
[14:41] <Surd> Didn't realize that was Brit, Claire.
[14:41] <Cleo> Done by two media students
[14:42] <eliza> I haven't seen that, will visit, Claire.
[14:42] <PbN> heath bunting, of course -- love his readme
[14:43] <steve_d> i teach web authoring p/t and some of those students are really going for it - i presume things will take off soon ...
[14:43] <Surd> Am I mistaken, though, Steve and Elizabeth, in thinking that there is nonetheless somehow a surprising shortage of British net.workers? Is this just me?
[14:43] <Cleo> actually, it's all over the net of late i see
[14:44] <eliza> We are a much smaller country Jim! And we often still pay for web access
[14:44] <Cleo> do you have to pay for your time online, or can you make no cost local calls?
[14:44] <Surd> But even relative to Canada or Australia, it seems.
[14:44] <steve_d> i discovered a few sites which seemed moribund but i'm always looking
[14:45] <Cleo> that's a moola matter in Europe I've been told
[14:45] <eliza> Free is coming in. I'm still paying (because I think my ISP will protect me from the Loveyou bug, etc)
[14:45] <steve_d> i'm still paying too
[14:45] <noname> Steve, do you think that if we rely too much on scripting (JS), the works will be hard to view due to the incompatibility in the future browsers? Because, i think, technology comes and goes....
[14:45] <PbN> well, I pay for ISP access, too, here in Canada
[14:45] <steve_d> free is available thru portals - eughh
[14:46] <Surd> Is it just a moola matter or is the british-poets list indicative of some cultural aspect that resists literary with a vengeance?
[14:46] <Cleo> that idea is frightening ...
[14:46] <steve_d> as i said earlier, there may be a time when we need an [old]web emulator
[14:46] <PbN> noname, that's a good point -- beyond code -- all of these techs generally, yes?
[14:47] ***tablelamp has joined #defib
[14:47] <jackdaw> jackdaw perches on tablelamp
[14:47] <noname> that's why my all-time-favorite works are Ted's
[14:48] <PbN> watchit, tablelamp... messy bird...
[14:48] *Cleo who is 'no name?'
[14:48] <steve_d> some british-poets are possibly a little insecure about abandoning "standard literacy"
[14:48] <eliza> Non mainstream poetries in UK don't feel too strong; there is perhaps a lack of confidence & the energy it brings, to do new stuff...
[14:48] <noname> Hey Claire, Hi, This is Duc Thuan.....
[14:48] <Cleo> hey, sometimes i'm a little nervous about it too!
[14:49] *Cleo he's sublime isn't he?)
[14:50] <joecow> i don't think it is necessary that all poets embrace webpoetry
[14:50] <jackdaw> caw
[14:50] *Surd thinks Ted's the master of the raster
[14:50] <PbN> joe -- that's blasphemous!
[14:50] <PbN> :)
[14:50] <steve_d> i agree joe
[14:50] <Cleo> moi aussi
[14:51] <joecow> there's a little devil on my left shoulder
[14:51] <PbN> or a bird?
[14:51] <Cleo> each form has it's own just medium for which it's suited
[14:51] <tablelamp> tablelamp is considering this all and does not know what he thinks except that he is nervous and kind of a paper sort of writer. this is like the paper is alive.
[14:51] <noname> The problem will be solved, i think, we can make a standard browser for viewing all the web poetry works we create
[14:52] <jackdaw> a crow is a crow
[14:52] <joecow> has to be a connection with that bird
[14:52] <Surd> Definitely. And part of the edge is in the resistance you encounter along it, that tension.
[14:52] <Cleo> lol!
[14:52] <jackdaw> pecks at tablelamp's paper edges
[14:53] <tablelamp> thank you
[14:53] <PbN> tablelamp (strange nick) -- this is like the paper is alive -- that's good!
[14:53] <noname> The problem will be solved, i think, unless we can make a standard browser for viewing all the web poetry works we create
[14:53] <Cleo> there's something a jorie graham (on paper) gives me that is utterly different from what i get with web poetry, and vice versa
[14:53] <joecow> i think web as extension of paper publishing is one paradigm
[14:54] <Cleo> each has their place
[14:54] <PbN> noname, will this happen?
[14:54] <joecow> paradigm is the wrong word perhaps - but this is how i see the web browser - while i think others see it as evolving or creating a space for film, sound, etc
[14:55] <joecow> also i think it's important to distinguish between web and web browser in these discussions
[14:55] <Cleo> i don't want a piece of the pie here tho, i want a new pie -
[14:55] <PbN> :)
[14:56] <joecow> ?
[14:56] <noname> Ted, if we can write code, and i think there are folks in webartery can do it, or we can make it a collaborative works b/t the ones who can write code very well....
[14:56] <jackdaw> sing sing
[14:57] *Cleo {who's "tablelamp?"
[14:57] <PbN> the one with 4 legs, C
[14:57] <jackdaw> bitten, lacey lampshade
[14:57] *Cleo jackdaw refuses to tell me who s/he is -
[14:58] <noname> I've been always dreaming of a simple browser that can view our own works
[14:58] <jackdaw> i'm morning glory
[14:58] *Cleo hrumph
[14:58] <jackdaw> the ipomoea
[14:58] <tablelamp> table lamp lives in the woods in Vermont, is 57, writes, does not have electricty, heats with wood and just got a computer
[14:58] <Cleo> ah, the poet from fop yes?
[14:58] <PbN> Duc Thuan, yes... this is possible already with many do-it-yourself browsers, yes?
[14:59] <joecow> tablelamp - battery-powered computer?
[14:59] <jackdaw> morning glory is on fop
[14:59] <tablelamp> yep
[14:59] <Cleo> how can you run a computer with no electricity? laptop?
[14:59] <tablelamp> yep
[14:59] <joecow> how long you been living like this?
[14:59] <tablelamp> 27 years
[14:59] <joecow> no shit?
[14:59] <tablelamp> yep
[15:00] <PbN> yep
[15:00] <tablelamp> yep
[15:00] <Cleo> do you have a 'real' world name/
[15:00] <joecow> do you live near burlington or other town?
[15:00] <Cleo> ?
[15:00] <noname> Ted, really? Do you know any of it, Ted?
[15:00] <tablelamp> life near montpelier
[15:00] <Cleo> echo echo ...
[15:00] <jackdaw> i have been there
[15:01] <PbN> noname, well sure there are 'freeware' browsers with source code and etc., but I've never looked into them
[15:01] <tablelamp> yeah, of course I have a real life name
[15:01] <jackdaw> but montpelier france....
[15:01] <PbN> If we all build our own -- then what?
[15:01] <joecow> i'm envious tablelamp
[15:01] <eliza> I have to go; goodbye all; good night Steve.
[15:01] <Cleo> what about linux?
[15:01] <steve_d> thanks for coming, elizabeth
[15:01] <Cleo> bye eliza - nice to meet you -
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[15:02] <tablelamp> damn , everybody is leaving
[15:02] <PbN> C, linux, DT, perhaps here?
[15:03] <Cleo> i'm afraid i'm to into the bells and whistles kinetic element - adds a life i always missed in my static work
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[15:03] <noname> Ted, the visitors only need to download one time in their whole, they don't have to upgrade or switch to higher version or b/t IE and NS.....
[15:03] <PbN> I'm not convinced a 'third browser' is really going to make anything better...
[15:03] ***tablelamp has left #defib
[15:03] <steve_d> before anyone else leaves i'd like to thank you all for coming
[15:45] <Surd> Thanks very much, Steve. I've got to head out soon...
[15:46] <steve_d> thanks, jim, thanks, everyone
[15:46] <geniwate> yes, sorry steve. I've got to stop soon too
[15:47] <joecow> steve, I should probably have some dinner and get back to bed. thanks for having me. i look forward to seeing more of your work.
[15:48] <steve_d> ok, will do, claire, cheers
[15:49] <Surd> Thanks to all again.
[15:49] <Cleo> farewell -
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[15:50] <geniwate> tweet -
[15:50] ***geniwate has quit IRC (QUIT: User exited.)
[15:51] <jackdaw> ruffles feathers in pleasure
[15:51] <Surd> Yes, a good one... relaxed and thoughtful.
[15:51] <steve_d> be careful with that beak
[15:51] <Cleo> ow!
[15:51] <jackdaw> couldn't resist
[15:52] <Surd> OK, I've got to do some stuff... bye bye
[15:52] <Cleo> bye
[15:52] ***Surd has quit IRC (QUIT: User exited.)
Session Close: Sun May 07 15:52:38 2000

May 7/2000
a project of