MIEKAL AND
13:00 - 13:30
[12:59] ***xxxxxxx has left #defib
[13:00] mIEKAL "spellspell"
[13:01] mIEKAL in spellspell, each letter plays a feedback frequency when you click on it.
[13:01] mIEKAL tho Im still adjusting the feedback.
[13:02] David I have to go. Thanks, Jim. Great job, mIEKAL. Bye all.
[13:02] Surd So these are collaborative with another person in the making. What sort of collaboration, if any at all, do you imagine with the reader/viewer. Is that a collaboration?
[13:02] ***David has quit IRC (QUIT: User exited.)
[13:02] mIEKAL that's why Im making these "playable"
[13:02] mIEKAL & when they are presented in the end, there will be more of them
[13:03] mIEKAL inside a flash file that is a player for them altogether.
[13:03] mIEKAL one more
[13:03] mIEKAL "cybele's lost song"
[13:04] billseye miekal, good pieces -- i prefer these smaller interfaces, like lyric poems, that have a smaller range, not simple really, but understated, so more evokative
[13:04] mIEKAL I think of them as haiku, even tho I dont necessarily think it appropriate
[13:04] mIEKAL to call them that
[13:05] *[brick] is comfortable calling them haiku
[13:05] mIEKAL & they are meant to go with some texts also
[13:05] mIEKAL which Id like to try pasting a few thru here now, is that ok jim?
[13:05] billseye sure, or short shorts, from film,...
[13:05] Surd sure
[13:07] mIEKAL it doesnt work
[13:07] mIEKAL it only pastes one line in
[13:07] mIEKAL ah well
[13:07] [brick] yes, that's a limitation of the java
[13:07] Surd well, e me those and we'll put them in the hypertranscript, miekal.
[13:08] mIEKAL uhg...
[13:08] mIEKAL well jim, altogether its about 30 pages
[13:08] mIEKAL but I can send you a few.
[13:08] Surd great
[13:08] Surd You like Flash?
[13:08] mIEKAL I hate computers.
[13:08] mIEKAL well
[13:09] mIEKAL maybe
[13:09] mIEKAL I
[13:09] billseye how would you describe the texts, miekal, how do they go with the flash pieces?
[13:09] mIEKAL dont
[13:09] mIEKAL hate
[13:09] mIEKAL computers
[13:09] mIEKAL but
[13:09] mIEKAL I struggle
[13:09] mIEKAL with
[13:09] mIEKAL techne
[13:09] *elizabeth laughs
[13:09] mIEKAL I want wilderness in techne
[13:09] billseye to adapt aristotle, i love computers, but i love the truth more
[13:09] mIEKAL the texts are in the form of imaginary emails to cybele
[13:10] Surd The voice and the image can connect to the primal, I feel, easier than the written.
[13:10] mIEKAL I cant wait for voice navigation
[13:10] mIEKAL & for the monitor to disappear
[13:10] billseye "wilderness in techne" -- a good bumper sticker, along with "one program, one plug-in!"
[13:10] mIEKAL the new webartery line of personal products
[13:10] mIEKAL dont forget the coffee mugs
[13:11] billseye your statement about the primal recalls Walter Ong on voice and speech -- and that's how he envisioned computers "recalling" the voice
[13:11] mIEKAL & I dont know if I would be this present in cyberspace if I lived somewhere where there was a lot going on.
[13:11] billseye how's that?
[13:11] mIEKAL hard to say. I do love the seduction of computers more than anything tho
[13:12] mIEKAL I rely on the internet for my reading, for my culture...because its a good 100 miles from here.
[13:12] mIEKAL except for what I make happen myself.
[13:12] billseye ah, the seduction, i'm glad you wrote that
[13:12] billseye same for me miekal, cuz i live in San Diego ;)
[13:12] mIEKAL its computer's most holy virtue
[13:12] mIEKAL what's the same
[13:13] mIEKAL I live in a town of 60 people
[13:13] mIEKAL how can you compare it to san diego.
[13:13] billseye culture is a good 100 miles from here -- just a little joke...
[13:13] Surd Did you start the town?
[13:13] mIEKAL no, we have about a quarter of the buildings in this town
[13:14] mIEKAL but its a regular little village, originally a farming town
[13:14] billseye how do the other three-quarters perceive you and the village?
[13:14] mIEKAL we have the old school 28,000 sq ft
[13:14] mIEKAL people are largely indifferent,
[13:14] Surd are they farming?
[13:14] mIEKAL some of the fundamentalists equate candles, drums, music jams as devil worship.
[13:15] mIEKAL dairy farming,
[13:15] mIEKAL not a lot of ways to make money out here.
[13:15] mIEKAL unless you have yr own thing going.
[13:15] Surd headquarters of beliefware?
[13:15] Surd Coffee mugs??
[13:15] billseye dairy farming on one side of town, devil worship on the other -- i love this country
[13:15] elizabeth This Londoner has to leave now; thanks for the meeting.
[13:15] mIEKAL beliefware is the future jim
[13:16] mIEKAL by e! thanks for coming.
[13:16] Surd Thanks, elizabeth.
[13:16] elizabeth see u m, all
[13:16] ***elizabeth has quit IRC (QUIT: User exited.)
[13:16] billseye say more about "beliefware" miekal -- i like the word
[13:16] mIEKAL when I first started making pieces on a mac SE in 87 that is the word I used to describe what I was doing
[13:17] mIEKAL crossmedia beliefware.
[13:17] mIEKAL the idea being a cross of pataphysics & vapor ware idea...
[13:17] mIEKAL software for paradigms that only exist in the imagination
[13:18] billseye what paradigms? whose imagination?
[13:18] mIEKAL the imagination of all who use it, in their subconscious, accessed & not
[13:19] mIEKAL paradigms of what we consider reality to be.
[13:19] mIEKAL for instance Im very affected by the theorem in physics
[13:19] mIEKAL that the brain is a 3-d decoder for a holographic universe
[13:20] billseye interesting -- how does one "program" a piece to be open to user's subconscious...
[13:20] [brick] each piece contains all the information
[13:20] mIEKAL so our experience of reality is limited by our very very 3 dimensional language
[13:20] billseye yeah, i'm interested in that theorem too -- there's a pop science book on it too, right -- the Holographic Universe?
[13:20] mIEKAL ambiguity
[13:21] mIEKAL right
[13:21] mIEKAL Ive spent a lot of time exploring other concepts of space
[13:21] mIEKAL like shamanic & aborigine
[13:22] mIEKAL & all that Im ever left with is that reality is language construct.
[13:22] Surd Space in what sense?
[13:22] billseye could you point to a couple texts? -- i'd love to read on this...
[13:22] mIEKAL there is a fantastic book on the aborigine dreamtime
[13:22] [brick] b.l. whorf spoke of speakers of different languages existing in different realities
[13:22] mIEKAL I think his name is robert lawlor.
[13:23] Surd Someone has said that language draws a magic circle around the realm of the thinkable.
[13:23] mIEKAL & there is a massive literature on the net about shamanic/hallucinogenic space...
[13:23] mIEKAL terrance mckennas first book is very good
[13:23] billseye do you see that idea -- reality as language construct -- repeated in other belief systems? like aborigine?
[13:23] mIEKAL the archaic revival
[13:24] mIEKAL that's what ayahuasca culture is all about, seems to me.
[13:24] billseye so bring it back to the Web -- how does that fit in...
[13:24] mIEKAL is the web the other or is it us?
[13:24] billseye both?
[13:25] mIEKAL I think of the web as the earth as an conscious entity, hard-wiring itself
[13:25] mIEKAL in order to not self destruct.
[13:25] Surd hard wiring to us?
[13:26] mIEKAL we are cells of a super-consciousness that is only in the very few seconds of becoming self aware.
[13:26] mIEKAL among us.
[13:26] mIEKAL not for our sake tho
[13:26] mIEKAL we are just another dinosaur in the bigger picture.
[13:27] billseye yes, but what about the hard realities of just how much of the earth is wired? seems a bit troubling to suggest that the earth's consciousness is available to only a small portion of the earth's inhabitants -- seriously
[13:27] Surd Gaia hypothesis + Web supra consciousness?
[13:27] [brick] but it's expanding so fast, bill
[13:28] mIEKAL but bill wouldnt you say that the people who stand to have the most chance of affecting changes
[13:28] mIEKAL to politics, community, technology, ecology
[13:28] mIEKAL are indeed slowly becoming co-existent in a space that never existed before.
[13:28] mIEKAL & the problem is the way I am talking about it.
[13:28] mIEKAL because it so easily sounds like new age fluff.
[13:29] mIEKAL because our language is so limited by words that are not empowered.
[13:29] mIEKAL but are weighted down by connotations & assumptions.
[13:29] billseye yes, and i don't want to go too far down this road because it's not an argument i favor usually, but playing devil's advocate, it might suggest that the web power grid just overlays those that already exist, and the "elite mind" goes on making these decisions for the unwired world
     


Dec 5/99
a project of webartery.com &