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reiner-strasser.de |
| [12:31] |
<Deena> |
does the forest communicate? |
| [12:31] |
<Surd> |
It seems to me that the 'interactivity' a reader
engages in online involves a physical type of action that previously,
in print, was conceptual. |
| [12:31] |
<reiner> |
what do you think - does the forest communicate?
|
| [12:31] |
<David> |
physical beyond mouse and click, Jim?
|
| [12:32] |
<Surd> |
But there also a conceptual interactivity as
before. |
| [12:32] |
<echo> |
yes..but do we listen to the forest?
|
| [12:32] |
<komninos> |
yes |
| [12:32] |
<Deena> |
I think that we interpret the forest, and listen
to our interpretations |
| [12:32] |
<tom> |
mouse and click is a gesture - like handwriting
or not? |
| [12:32] |
<anniea> |
nice deena |
| [12:32] |
<PbN> |
forest -- yes -- it communicates IF you listen
closely |
| [12:33] |
<Surd> |
I mean the mouse and click, the physical navigating
and making connections physically previously was a purely conceptual
activity. |
| [12:33] |
<reiner> |
so - you are in the middle of 'your' world
|
| [12:33] |
<Deena> |
Surd, how does the reader online engage in different
ways than the reader in print? |
| [12:33] |
<billseye> |
"interactivity" over-exaggerates what happens
-- it's still the dream of virtual interface |
| [12:33] |
<komninos> |
at all times the centre of its universe
|
| [12:33] |
<cinader> |
i think the forest communicates to us in our
dreams, myths, legends |
| [12:33] |
<billseye> |
most of the user-engagement (user assembly)
is still conceptual, like in print |
| [12:34] |
<Surd> |
Deena - just as I said... and additionally.
|
| [12:34] |
<cinader> |
"my world" is partly instinctual |
| [12:34] |
<PbN> |
a forest of a single blade of grass growing
through a sea of concrete -- listen and learn |
| [12:34] |
<tom> |
doesn't the forest communicate through the writer?
|
| [12:35] |
<Surd> |
Bill, yes, we are not making twitch work.
|
| [12:35] |
<reiner> |
nice idea |
| [12:35] |
<Surd> |
Like Quake. |
| [12:35] |
<komninos> |
authors create vitual texts, they are actualized
in certain ways, books,websites,live performance, and then realized
by each reader, perhaps? |
| [12:36] |
<Deena> |
Tom, yes, and the reader than interprets the
writer's interpretations |
| [12:36] |
<billseye> |
so, then, what's physical besides mouse movement,
eye movement? -- interactivity as we know it is that plus conceptual
links, no? |
| [12:36] |
<David> |
In collaborations, the reader/writer connection
happens early as each |
| [12:36] |
<Deena> |
Well, I think it is more than physical. You
have to interpret the relationships. Why this links to this, how
this movement relates to the whole |
| [12:37] |
<reiner> |
the thoughts have to be continued by the reader
|
| [12:37] |
<David> |
collaborator reads what the others have written.
|
| [12:37] |
<cinader> |
visual texts -- icons --easily understood and
speaking to us on the level of dream symbols |
| [12:37] |
<echo> |
a connection in the physical brain...(what physical
is besides mouse movement.) |
| [12:37] |
<billseye> |
deena, i agree -- which makes the experience
closer to print than, say, karate |
| [12:38] |
<Surd> |
Moving toward imaginative and physical immersion,
that metaphor. |
| [12:38] |
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| [12:38] |
<PbN> |
Re: your work incorporates a great deal of 'interactive'
elements, but I would think to say it is about this is to miss the
real point ... |
| [12:38] |
<Surd> |
Dreaming it real. |
| [12:38] |
<tom> |
i try and combine the visual and verbal, but
the less explicit the better? Reiner? |
| [12:38] |
<komninos> |
so jim, hypertexts give us extra navigational
tools, but the text/image/sound still makes us want to follow that
path |
| [12:38] |
<billseye> |
yeah, but the dream is conceptual |
| [12:38] |
<PbN> |
I see the interactivity as a means to opening
a world of creative discovery in the viewer/participant.
|
| [12:39] |
<PbN> |
Is this fair -- |
| [12:39] |
|
*jley smiles a hello to all ...
Hi Reiner ... and settles back to listen |
| [12:39] |
<reiner> |
hi jen |
| [12:39] |
<reiner> |
interactivity ----- |
| [12:39] |
<echo> |
hi Jen, and Martha, and Deena. beth here.
|
| [12:40] |
<reiner> |
my idea of art is |
| [12:40] |
<Deena> |
Hi Jen, Beth, et al. Yes, the hypertext has
to entice the reader in |
| [12:40] |
<Surd> |
Big canna worms, interactivity, tentacles everywhere.
|
| [12:40] |
<reiner> |
that it is a 'multi layer construction'
|
| [12:40] |
<Deena> |
But so does every other medium. Ht just has
a few more tools and lets the reader play a bit more. |
| [12:40] |
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| [12:41] |
<reiner> |
you may find it in every picture or book
|
| [12:41] |
<jley> |
we just have to convince the 'straight reading
audience' they *want* interactivity ;) hi Deena beth Martha and
you guys too |
| [12:41] |
<jley> |
what I like about Reiner's work is that the
tech feels very human to me ... it shimmers ... entices ...
|
| [12:41] |
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| [12:41] |
<echo> |
i was thinking of the physiology of the brain..
|
| [12:41] |
<reiner> |
yes you may find it in every art piece
|
| [12:42] |
<reiner> |
but there is a difference in my view
|
| [12:42] |
<echo> |
how we build connections thru synapses
|
| [12:42] |
<mandola> |
utter newbie here -- can someone post a url
to any of reiner's work |
| [12:42] |
<reiner> |
that you 'add' combine these layers in a 'real'
way in media-art |
| [12:42] |
<reiner> |
i have made a little link list |
| [12:42] |
<billseye> |
good way of putting it, jen -- it invites immersion
of the sort described above |
| [12:43] |
<reiner> |
The links are here. |
| [12:43] |
<Deena> |
Reiner, how do you see the interactions between
the layers? |
| [12:43] |
<billseye> |
reiner, the notion of 'layer' is huge in the
poetics of this stuff, right |
| [12:43] |
<PbN> |
Re, interactivity then is like a portal to layers
-- physical (shimmering) and conceptual ? |
| [12:44] |
<reiner> |
layers - picture elements+changes + sound +
'interactivity' |
| [12:44] |
<reiner> |
you can move thru the layers e.g. by clicking
|
| [12:44] |
<billseye> |
Nari makes good point |
| [12:45] |
<reiner> |
but in dhtml you can see the layers also in
the code |
| [12:45] |
<reiner> |
layers are not only meant concrete |
| [12:45] |
<reiner> |
but also |
| [12:45] |
<reiner> |
as layers of thinking |
| [12:45] |
<jley> |
ooo I like that ... 'layers of thinking'
|
| [12:45] |
<reiner> |
e.g. memory, dream, reflection .... |
| [12:46] |
<billseye> |
there's the layering of what you get on top
of the layering of code, plus the layers of thinking |
| [12:46] |
<David> |
multi plied text |
| [12:46] |
<reiner> |
i think the trick is |
| [12:46] |
<Deena> |
How do you see your layers of thinking relate
to the structure of the overall whole? |
| [12:46] |
<reiner> |
to combine the stuff in way |
| [12:46] |
<billseye> |
poly-pliant hypermedia |
| [12:46] |
<Surd> |
I like the way you combine the literal layers
via mouseover that result in the revelation of different images
at once. |
| [12:46] |
<reiner> |
that the reader is intrigued by ... |
| [12:47] |
<komninos> |
reiner, you seem to work the area of nostalgia
quite a lot, do you find other moods more difficult to express in
our medium |
| [12:48] |
<reiner> |
area of nostalgia - i am not sure to understand
right |
| [12:48] |
<echo> |
nostalgia=i remember |
| [12:48] |
|
*jley is experienced extreme bated
breath syndrome ... Reiner, intrigued by .... ???? |
| [12:49] |
<billseye> |
=i remember and sigh |
| [12:49] |
<komninos> |
well it sends me back to my own memories and
past experiences |
| [12:49] |
<echo> |
:o) |
| [12:49] |
<echo> |
breathe in, breathe out..:o) |
| [12:49] |
<reiner> |
what i have made with the little pieces
|
| [12:49] |
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| [12:50] |
<reiner> |
was the trial to express 'little' moods or 'thoughts'
|
| [12:50] |
<reiner> |
to create a net opera will be quiet difficult
and time expensive .9 |
| [12:50] |
<Surd> |
Is the notion of lyric important to you, Reiner?
|
| [12:51] |
<reiner> |
notion of lyric § |
| [12:51] |
<Surd> |
As in lyrical poetry, for instance. |
| [12:51] |
<reiner> |
people call my thoughts sometimes lyrically
|
| [12:51] |
<reiner> |
it is a sort of category |
| [12:51] |
<billseye> |
lyric, yeah -- in reiner's work there is that
wordsworthian "emotion recollected in solitude", or whatever that
line is |
| [12:52] |
<Deena> |
It seems as though you blend lyric words and
lyric images, particularly in skin. |
| [12:52] |
<Surd> |
tranquility, not solitude |
| [12:52] |
<billseye> |
ah... |
| [12:52] |
<Deena> |
So the lyric goes beyond the text and into the
layers of thought, which aren't necessarily cast in words...
|
| [12:52] |
|
*jley agrees with Deena ... well
put :) |
| [12:52] |
<reiner> |
i think a net piece can be made with a bad text
:) |
| [12:53] |
<Deena> |
How do you see readers interacting with the
words/images lyricism? |
| [12:53] |
<Surd> |
Right, the lyric is a broad notion. |
| [12:53] |
<reiner> |
means ---- if a text is too good --- you need
no other elements |
| [12:53] |
<echo> |
dancing with re? :o) |
| [12:54] |
<reiner> |
deena - ? - i 'built' the pieces |
| [12:54] |
<reiner> |
and what i do is to play different roles
|
| [12:54] |
<billseye> |
good text? no elements? hm? -- seriously?
|
| [12:54] |
<reiner> |
roles of different viewers |
| [12:54] |
<reiner> |
and i look at ... and maybe correct |
| [12:54] |
<Surd> |
I think you're right to resist categorization
simply as a lyric artist. It is broad but does have limitations.
|
| [12:54] |
<PbN> |
Re -- odd Q -- but I've never heard you say
and am curious -- Gustav Klimpt ? Your Web work reminds me of his
paintings... |
| [12:55] |
<echo> |
words/images lyrical, interaction , dance as
a metaphor. |
| [12:55] |
<reiner> |
klimt --- ? ---- surely i know his work
|
| [12:56] |
<reiner> |
i use not as much gold and ornaments - i think
.9 |
| [12:56] |
<PbN> |
any stronger connections? |
| [12:56] |
<reiner> |
no --- if i think at art |
| [12:56] |
<reiner> |
visual art - i prefer paul klee ... |
| [12:56] |
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| [12:57] |
<anniea> |
i thought of saenredam |
| [12:57] |
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| [12:57] |
<jley> |
aha that makes a lot of sense to me reiner ...
there's a compartmentalization/ a facetting in a Klee work
|
| [12:57] |
<David> |
and also that element of nostalgia |
| [12:57] |
<reiner> |
klee's work is more intellectual ......
|
| [12:58] |
<reiner> |
but very sensitive :) |
| [12:58] |
<PbN> |
David (or lyric) |
| [12:58] |
<jley> |
what would you say are your influences reiner??
|
| [12:59] |
<reiner> |
my friends in realspace and on the net :)
|
| [12:59] |
<reiner> |
haha |
| [12:59] |
<jley> |
hehe ... jley pokes reiner ... historically
then :) |
| [12:59] |
<reiner> |
more .... i can tell you which painters or writers
i like |
| [12:59] |
<reiner> |
but there is not as much connection |
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