| [12:45] |
<cfunk> |
I bet..
|
| [12:46] |
<LossGlazier> |
Tom, yes, ideally, phases of Mike's work could be featured too
|
| [12:47] |
|
*carolyn wonders mike who?
|
| [12:47] |
<LossGlazier> |
Mike Kelleher
|
| [12:47] |
<Cleo> |
i like the idea of working with other's enmeshed in a text genre - I dream of working with sheila murphy or peter ganick
|
| [12:47] |
<Jim> |
Well I think that the concept of the hub for the innovative, and as an active thing, rather than just an archive, has shown itself extremely dynamic nowhere more than EPC.
|
| [12:47] |
<LossGlazier> |
editor of "The Field" project
|
| [12:48] |
<carolyn> |
sorry, but i've got to fly. wonderful to see the work that you are doing, loss.
|
| [12:49] |
<tomb> |
loss, url for 'the field"?
|
| [12:49] |
<Jim> |
Fly high, Caroln.
|
| [12:49] |
<PbN> |
thanks, Carolyn -- best!
|
| [12:49] |
<carolyn> |
talk to you all anon.
|
| [12:49] |
<Cleo> |
good bye my dear -
|
| [12:49] |
<carolyn> |
bye.
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| [12:49] |
<LossGlazier> |
thanks
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| [12:49] |
|
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| [12:49] |
<LossGlazier> |
as to the role of the epc, i'd certainly encourage folks to think about
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| [12:50] |
<LossGlazier> |
such special projects
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| [12:50] |
|
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| [12:50] |
<LossGlazier> |
working with David has been very fruitful
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| [12:50] |
<LossGlazier> |
i'm so crushed with work that extra energy like that
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| [12:51] |
<LossGlazier> |
makes magic
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| [12:51] |
|
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| [12:51] |
<tomb> |
i must go, too, by all
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| [12:51] |
<Cleo> |
mmm indeed!
|
| [12:51] |
<Jim> |
see you Tom.
|
| [12:51] |
<Cleo> |
bye tomb
|
| [12:51] |
<LossGlazier> |
by tom
|
| [12:51] |
<PbN> |
Tom, good to c u...
|
| [12:51] |
<LossGlazier> |
i mean bye tom
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| [12:51] |
|
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| [12:51] |
<LossGlazier> |
what do folks think about what plug ins mean to our work
|
| [12:52] |
<PbN> |
hate em
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| [12:52] |
<LossGlazier> |
i mean, is it troubling to anyone say
|
| [12:52] |
<PbN> |
yes
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| [12:52] |
<LossGlazier> |
to work purely in flash
|
| [12:52] |
<PbN> |
ack!
|
| [12:52] |
<LossGlazier> |
not knowing if it will some day just disappear?
|
| [12:52] |
<PbN> |
uh huh
|
| [12:52] |
<Cleo> |
when i get blanks that ask me to get a plug-in no one's ever heard of, then find i have to pay for it .
|
| [12:52] |
<Jim> |
Well, it will all disappear, but will it simultaneously transform, that's the question to me.
|
| [12:53] |
<Cleo> |
but standards are fine [like flash, shockwave, RealAudio/video
|
| [12:53] |
<LossGlazier> |
Yes, Jim. There are factors for survival though.
|
| [12:53] |
<Jim> |
True
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| [12:53] |
<LossGlazier> |
For example, no matter how much things change one would assume there will always be a way to view old gif files
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| [12:54] |
<Jim> |
Maybe.
|
| [12:54] |
<LossGlazier> |
or old Word files
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| [12:54] |
<PbN> |
GIFs are proprietary
|
| [12:54] |
<mez> |
doezn't thizz s-sue [ of using potentially obsolete technolgee] get 2 the core of net.wurked artwork? I mean, shod we, as artistz, have these con.cerns prominent when creating, or is this a type of concussive [but sometimez necessary] censorship?
|
| [12:54] |
<Cleo> |
maybe trying to view will someday be like trying to find a needle for your 'old' turntable!
|
| [12:55] |
<PbN> |
yes
|
| [12:55] |
<Jim> |
For myself, I pick the tools I need to do the type of work I imagine and try to consider all the rest but have to go with what I need...
|
| [12:55] |
<PbN> |
who here regularly views Targa files?
|
| [12:55] |
<mez> |
not me
|
| [12:55] |
<LossGlazier> |
Does that mean that a lifetime's work could simply be unviewable
|
| [12:55] |
<Cleo> |
i don't even know what they are [except by name]
|
| [12:56] |
<cfunk> |
yes, perhaps...
|
| [12:56] |
<Jim> |
Joseph Kosuth has speculated that if anything remains of his work, it will not be the objects themselves but the philosophy and approach...
|
| [12:56] |
<PbN> |
Targa, proprietary, too, I think, 24-bit image format, popular a while back
|
| [12:57] |
<Jim> |
... the poetics...
|
| [12:57] |
<Cleo> |
i think the larger comps., such as macromedia, will make backwards compatible players [ i hope!
|
| [12:57] |
<PbN> |
No
|
| [12:57] |
<mez> |
i wunder if some ppl subconsciouslee wurk with the ideer of possible plugin-challenged wurk? i tend nott to create anything in flash that couldn't b replicated in .gifz, 4 n-stance....
|
| [12:57] |
<LossGlazier> |
the problem is that if you see information from their viewpoint
|
| [12:57] |
<PbN> |
I cannot get the latest Flash from them for Win v.3.11
|
| [12:57] |
<LossGlazier> |
old information is normally useless
|
| [12:57] |
<Jim> |
Yes, that's an important point, Loss.
|
| [12:58] |
<Cleo> |
really pbn? that's bad!
|
| [12:58] |
<PbN> |
I think this whole q is part of what *makes* new med *new* ???
|
| [12:58] |
<Jim> |
The 'industry' does not care to support the past but to be 'positioned' for the present and the future.
|
| [12:58] |
<Cleo> |
it moves so damned rapidly!
|
| [12:59] |
<cfunk> |
people will have to establish a trust which pays for someone to upgrade their hardware, software, files, memory etc
|
| [12:59] |
<Cleo> |
'new' gets old so fast!
|
| [12:59] |
<LossGlazier> |
right chris
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| [12:59] |
<cfunk> |
so they don't completely vanish
|
| [12:59] |
<LossGlazier> |
i sure would like to develop the epc to such an extend
|
| [12:59] |
<Cleo> |
but that won't account for work which utilizes older technologies
|
| [12:59] |
<LossGlazier> |
that it could keep track of given formats
|
| [13:00] |
<cfunk> |
hard copy, or video copy might come in handy too
|
| [13:00] |
<PbN> |
ah, but not all new med can exist offline
|
| [13:00] |
<cfunk> |
some sort of representation
|
| [13:00] |
<mez> |
rhizome artbase has a proviso built in that allowz em to s-sentially change/update wurk listed, so as to nott loose high-tekk net.wurk......
|
| [13:00] |
<Cleo> |
maybe there will be some standards when we've calmed down a bit ...?
|
| [13:01] |
<cfunk> |
true, pbn, but what else can you think of besides total erasure
|
| [13:01] |
<PbN> |
still calming up?
|
| [13:01] |
<Cleo> |
lol!
|
| [13:01] |
<cfunk> |
standards? set by govt.? would these be useful?
|
| [13:01] |
<PbN> |
Chris, I can't -- that's Loss' job :)
|
| [13:01] |
<Jim> |
There is no calming down in a market predicated on continual growth and change.
|
| [13:02] |
<LossGlazier> |
it puts artists in a curiously fragile position
|
| [13:02] |
<LossGlazier> |
i think it's good to acknowledge that
|
| [13:02] |
<Cleo> |
i imagine you're right - but what about video standards I mean - the tools used to create work change, but the viewing apparatus stays the same
|
| [13:03] |
<cfunk> |
haven't artists always been in c.f. position, whatever the tech?
|
| [13:03] |
<LossGlazier> |
and keep in minds some way to survive through all this
|
| [13:03] |
|
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| [13:03] |
<Cleo> |
apolgies for my horrid typing/Os
|
| [13:03] |
<PbN> |
bluechick -- hi!
|
| [13:03] |
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| [13:03] |
<grey-wolf> |
hi
|
| [13:03] |
<mez> |
i havta go all, trace chat is ca[u]l.ling:)
|
| [13:03] |
<PbN> |
things are getting colorful...
|
| [13:03] |
<bluechick> |
hi pbn
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| [13:03] |
<Jim> |
Thanks, Mez, see you.
|
| [13:03] |
<LossGlazier> |
Glad you could make it mez
|
| [13:04] |
<Cleo> |
what's there mez?
|
| [13:04] |
<PbN> |
hi grey-wolf
|
| [13:04] |
<Cleo> |
bye/hi
|
| [13:04] |
<grey-wolf> |
whats this chat about?
|
| [13:04] |
<bluechick> |
what's u p pp;
|
| [13:04] |
<mez> |
great thingz loss, keep it up...and to all, later:)
|
| [13:04] |
<bluechick> |
ppl
|
| [13:04] |
<PbN> |
poetry
|
| [13:04] |
<mez> |
trace has a general chat on, thought i'd be supportive:)
|
| [13:04] |
<grey-wolf> |
oh
|
| [13:04] |
<bluechick> |
i love poetry
|
| [13:04] |
<LossGlazier> |
Another question I had was about tools
|
| [13:04] |
<cfunk> |
go trAce!
|
| [13:04] |
<bluechick> |
that's actually my next unit
|
| [13:04] |
<Jim> |
Tell me about your book, if you'd like, Loss.
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| [13:04] |
|
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| [13:04] |
<LossGlazier> |
are there extraordinary tools for poets out there?
|
| [13:04] |
<PbN> |
blue, welcome!
|
| [13:04] |
|
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| [13:04] |
<grey-wolf> |
wanna hear a poem?
|
| [13:05] |
<Jim> |
no
|
| [13:05] |
<bluechick> |
thanks PBN
|
| [13:05] |
<bluechick> |
yes
|
| [13:05] |
<grey-wolf> |
ok
|
| [13:05] |
<bluechick> |
lol
|
| [13:05] |
<cfunk> |
go ahead
|
| [13:05] |
<Cleo> |
this is a specific chat
|
| [13:05] |
<grey-wolf> |
for Love...believe in fate, wat's meant for you, and it will come.Things that belong to you will ultimately come to you. What goes round will come round. Love will come
|
| [13:06] |
<bluechick> |
nice
|
| [13:06] |
<grey-wolf> |
i have alot more....
|
| [13:06] |
|
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| [13:06] |
<bluechick> |
give us more
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| [13:06] |
|
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| [13:06] |
<cfunk> |
i've heard that one before
|
| [13:06] |
<grey-wolf> |
ok
|
| [13:06] |
<bluechick> |
hey sierra
|
| [13:06] |
<bluechick> |
oh
|
| [13:06] |
<LossGlazier> |
grey-wolf, why don't you listen for a while?
|
| [13:06] |
<PbN> |
ditto
|
| [13:06] |
<grey-wolf> |
ok
|
| [13:06] |
<Jim> |
Listen or leave.
|
| [13:06] |
<grey-wolf> |
ok
|
| [13:06] |
<Cleo> |
[was there not just a thread concerning this issue?
|
| [13:06] |
<bluechick> |
i think so cleo
|
| [13:07] |
|
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| [13:07] |
<LossGlazier> |
are there extraordinary tools for poets out there?
|
| [13:07] |
<Cleo> |
that's why we should use the trace room Deena offered i think
|
| [13:07] |
<Jim> |
No problem, I have op status and the boot here.
|
| [13:07] |
<Cleo> |
not sure what you mean loss
|
| [13:08] |
<LossGlazier> |
i've been trying to get the univ to set up something for the epc
|
| [13:08] |
<Cleo> |
lol!
|
| [13:08] |
|
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| [13:08] |
<LossGlazier> |
i just wondered what tools people are using and if there are tools folks would say are particularly good for poets to do digital work
|
| [13:09] |
<LossGlazier> |
(it's amazing how hard it is for people to listen. if they can't be the only voice they leave.)
|
| [13:09] |
<cfunk> |
html been berry berry good to me
|
| [13:10] |
<Cleo> |
[yet another 'me' generation ...]
|
| [13:10] |
<LossGlazier> |
if not we can talk about my book. what do you think jim? is our time almost up?
|
| [13:10] |
<PbN> |
yes, Chris -- you do wonderful ASCII/html work
|
| [13:10] |
<cfunk> |
talk about the book
|
| [13:10] |
<Cleo> |
i know nothing of the book - what's it about?
|
| [13:10] |
<Jim> |
Well the time is whenever we choose to conclude, Loss.
|
| [13:10] |
<cfunk> |
pbn: who you
|
| [13:10] |
<PbN> |
ted warnell
|
| [13:11] |
<cfunk> |
ah, hi ted
|
| [13:11] |
<LossGlazier> |
Well, I think it's amazing that a university press would pick it up.
|
| [13:11] |
<Jim> |
I'm very interested to hear about your book, Loss.
|
| [13:11] |
<Cleo> |
poem by nari
|
| [13:11] |
<LossGlazier> |
It argues the continuity between innovative practice from print practice
|
| [13:11] |
<LossGlazier> |
Let's say, it argues that by looking at innovative print practice
|
| [13:12] |
<Jim> |
What writers do you take up?
|
| [13:12] |
<LossGlazier> |
one can gain a particular perspective on the digital
|
| [13:12] |
<Cleo> |
you mean practice in the new media/net?
|
| [13:12] |
<LossGlazier> |
yes new media/net
|
| [13:13] |
<LossGlazier> |
there's a good deal of reference to innovative poets of the second half of the 20th century
|
| [13:13] |
<Jim> |
Such as?
|
| [13:13] |
<LossGlazier> |
as well as mac low, oulipo (to some extent), emmett williams
|
| [13:13] |
<LossGlazier> |
looks also at concrete poets
|
| [13:13] |
<cfunk> |
what do you say about hypertext/cyberpoetry
|
| [13:13] |
<LossGlazier> |
stein, william carlos williams
|
| [13:13] |
<Cleo> |
i think the perspective on this issue depends a lot on the generation viewing/creating the work - language seems to be particular to age
|
| [13:14] |
|
*PbN cranks up some Neil Young and settles in to the unfolding defib...
|
| [13:14] |
<LossGlazier> |
not to mention black mountain, language, etc.
|
| [13:14] |
<LossGlazier> |
one thing i attempt to do, chris,
|
| [13:14] |
<LossGlazier> |
is to survey what's been going on the last number of years
|
| [13:14] |
<LossGlazier> |
for example the Little Magazine CDs
|
| [13:15] |
<LossGlazier> |
all this extraordinary work
|
| [13:15] |
<LossGlazier> |
and i try to make a kind of informal catalog, or record of it,
|
| [13:15] |
<LossGlazier> |
or survey.
|
| [13:15] |
<Cleo> |
i wonder what some of those good old modernists would do with the new tools/language?
|
